In any case, I hired a local tile contractor who stated that his process is to grout the entire shower, and then apply a clear silicone caulk over the grout at all changes in plane (including in the niches)–which has been done. It simply isn’t draining the way it should. if you are unfortunate to have a base issue and have to replace it. Hi Rodger , I’m a newbie that just found the your super helpful Site . However, I am prepared to fix this myself eventually. This would give you the option to have either a plumber or a different installer or contractor cut the dry wall on the backside to investigate what the issue might be. We moved into the house in August 2020. The only two disadvantages to using caulk instead of grout are that you need to periodically remove and replace the caulk and, depending on your choice of grout, you may not be able to find a caulk that matches exactly. Normally in a shower will a tiled floor as well, the water will run down the wall over the waterproofing, onto the floor, again-over the waterproofing, then into the weep holes in the drain. The only time I will use grout for a plane change is when I am using epoxy grout. Additionally, there were color flaws in the surface of the tiles...one tile with extra black dye for example and popped bubble looking circles on quite a few of the tiles. I would put one about an inch from that corner (on either wall) and probably another on the opposite side of the shower by the other corner. However if you install glass type tiles one needs a non sanded grout. Always leave a joint for silicone. Thanks for the above comment. However, this installer says he has used this same type of caulk (not silicone) for many years and he has never had an issue. Either that or I can visit some tile/granite stores for a remnant. I am using the permacolor grout for my shower. The orange discoloration is mold. One of the most asked questions by do-it-yourselfer’s is whether they should use caulk or grout in the corners. We’ve written several articles about basement insulation and a cost effective approach to basement insulation using foam board and fiberglass insulation.Since writing those articles we’ve received quite a few questions about when to use a basement vapor barrier and when not to. I was planning on grouting the corners, so the tiles are not butted together. I’m confused. In a combination system (tile walls, acrylic or steel base) that is normally behind the wall tile and over the top of the base. After, cleaning the shower I noticed a Slight discoloration on a few areas on the grout. It sounds like we need to create some weep holes, but not sure if this can be done at this stage. Great website by the way. If there is any movement the caulk is flexible enough to move with it and remain in place. Tiles are white 4×12 with 1/16″ grout joint. We suspect that the grout is cracking due to movement (the shower is installed in a bathroom bump out and over a crawl space, and against two exterior walls—though they were reframed and well insulated during the remodel). Yes, the mesh tape with AD is fine. I’ve just finished tiling the bathtub walls and two questions if possible . I would put them about an inch from each corner on the back wall and one on each side wall about an inch from the edge of the shower (inside the glass). PentaUSA Tile Grout Repairs Renews Fills Tube, 3 Triple Protection, Fast Drying Grout Repair Kit, Heavy-Duty Grout Cleaner - Restore and Renew Grout Line, Easy and Safe to Use, White, 8.8 oz - 250 gr 5.0 out of 5 stars 3 I’ve been seeing cracked grout issues, particularly along the edge where the floor tiles meet the wall tiles. They are fast setting and you can get into trouble with them. Thank you. It is cause by permanently damp conditions (like a shower), especially at the bottom of the tile wall, which is where the water drains to. Link to Lowe's Home Improvement Home Page Lowe's Credit Cards Order ... For caulking around sinks, tubs, showers, countertops and ceramic tile floors. I want to use caulk, but thought you had to grout underneath, oops. New tile shower installed in June (18×24 porcelain, walls and ceiling, tile sheets over a hand-poured mud pan and liner, which I hope has been properly installed) has developed water seepage from behind the tile at one of the floor corner joints such that the grout remains wet well after the rest of the shower has dried–this has happened three times, most recently last week. Finishing tools help you make a uniform bead, though some people prefer to just use a wet finger. I am worried about creating a water damn of some sort. What do you use for the bottom of the niche? – if you ask a hundred different professionals you will more than likely receive fifty of each answer. Because latex and some silicone caulk will take paint, you can use white caulk and paint it to match any place you're using it. Would like some sort of shelf. Or should I just caulk? abs acos acosh addcslashes addslashes aggregate aggregate_info aggregate_methods aggregate_methods_by_list aggregate_methods_by_regexp aggregate_properties aggregate_properties_by Hi Roger, I plan on using epoxy grout in my shower and bathroom and I’m hoping to not have to use caulk. When using silicone caulk that can't be painted, choose the color that most closely matches the surrounding area, or select clear caulk for an unobtrusive look. However for the change of plane joints in the shower, I would want to use the colored silicone caulk such as at the corners and between the walls and the shower pan/tray. A local company measured the space and mixed their formula for an exact fit shower base, I love these too. The fourth is glass. It also keeps stuff out of that joint – stuff like mold or spaghetti sauce…. If it does not have a specific method to get into the drain it will build up behind that wall tile (unless the shower is not used often enough, in which case it will dry out through the grout lines, similar to your initial issue) or it will find another route out of the wall. You build and waterproof it in a method that always ends up at the drain in some manner. These products offer the easy use of latex with the added durability of silicone. You mentioned caulking on plane changes and cited wall to floor and wall to tub edge as examples. Based on what I have been reading, it is not advisable to caulk over grout. The easier, and proper, solution is to silicone first – I just don’t usually do that because of time restraints. We were fortunate when we were just learning we had a gentleman who owned his own tile company later selling it to a son. That simply means that if you are using sanded grout you cannot butt the tiles against each other at the corner and expect to be able to force grout into it. How much time do you think I have before I may have any or more damage than today? Was leaning towards the Mapei Flexcolor CQ or Fusion Pro. Do you grout everything, including the corners, then go back and scrap out the grout in the corners, then apply silicone? First: Water will ALWAYS get behind tile – always. Placing caulk over grout in the corners will just lead to cracked grout in the corners that can not fall out – but it’ll still be cracked. Best HD/Lowe’s grout suggestion for those and I think I’m set. Question: can we put silicone caulk over these areas to cover pink without causing further issues? Round edged, oval shaped, 3″-4″ wide, 1″-1 1/2″ thick. Because latex and some silicone caulk will take paint, you can use white caulk and paint it to match any place you're using it. In our first home I chose a solid onyx base-loved it, fantastically solid. My son told me all the cool kids are doin’ it! Silicone isn’t paintable and there is no primer that will stick to it. Morphological leveling. You can practice on a piece of cardboard or a tucked-away area before tackling visible projects. Although it is not flexible it will grab the tile well enough to prevent it from splitting or cracking out. In your case water is unable to run from the wall to the floor – something is stopping it at the bottom of the wall. Precautions must still be taken but the Epoxy is strong enough to withstand normal structural movement. While there are pros and cons of each, I am in the camp that uses caulk. Would we risk our tile cracking over time? Thoughts on which option is better? I’ve decided to have my privacy violated and start putting things on Facebook. If this barrier is around the entire perimeter, it may still just be showing up at that corner, if that corner happens to be the lowest point of the perimeter. I want to use it in change of plane as well to eliminate caulk from our showers. It doesn’t matter if it cracks or not, neither grout nor silicone in the corner has anything to do with your waterproofing or preventing water from getting behind your tile – that WILL happen anyway. Take A Sneak Peak At The Movies Coming Out This Week (8/12) “Look for the helpers” – Celebrities helping out amid Texas storm Professional Tile Installation Contractor Fort Collins and all of Northern Colorado. It’s actually likely Serratia marcescens, which is a bacteria. This haze is proving extremely difficult to remove, especially because it’s on marble and acids are a no-no. Some models may come with a convenient nozzle cutter or a swing-out wire puncture tool for caulk tube seals. Thank you for the post on using caulk or grout in corners. I also am not sure even if we remove the grout, how caulking just that corner will look given that the grout and caulk have such different textures, but my husband’s first instinct is to keep it simple and repair the current problem and deal with any future problems as they arise. Video Below: This video is also available on YouTube here: If you only want the instructions for mixing Plaster of Paris please go directly to the video. I normally just avoid the corners when grouting and scrape out any grout that does get in there. It’s a bathtub/shower combo with porcelain tiles measuring 3×9 in size. Choose a caulk gun that'll accommodate the type of caulk tube you'll use. Grout packed in there will do this (it will slow it tremendously, at least, not necessarily seal it off), but caulk or silicone FILLING those gaps will also do that. Humidity, weather, even the structure’s foundation all affect how much it moves. Latex and silicone caulk are the most common types. I would appreciate your thoughts given this new information. (the sanded vs. non-sanded actually doesn’t have anything to do with it.) Roger, Is that ok? It will not stay if the grout has no grout line to hold onto – if it is simply attempting to grab onto the face of the tiles at a 90 degree angle. It will stick to the face of the tile rather than needing a space between the tiles to grab. Notify me of follow-up comments by email. Do you have a traditional liner mud bed (the two layers with a liner between)? Any plane that changes direction is a change of plane. I am using the Aquadefense to waterproof the entire shower. I did not understand that water is meant to run behind the tile wall and under the tile floor to the drain, but this makes perfect sense since grout is porous (I did learn that sealing grout is not a waterproofing step). Can you clarify exactly where we should cut these weep holes (I assume along the floor) and how many? If your wall moves your grout will eventually crack – it’s that simple. Errors will be corrected where discovered, and Lowe's reserves the right to revoke any stated offer and to correct any errors, inaccuracies or omissions including after an order has been submitted. Installer did not use silicone caulk at the change of planes–apparently grout vs. caulk at the corners is a subject of some debate (yes, I have been doing some internet reading) — but it appears the industry standard, and of course your valued opinion, would have been to use caulk. Thanks again for your help. Caulk is flexible. Fast forward now, to Feb 2021 when I realized that it may not be covered under warranty because fine print (the crack needs to be a certain size). What do you think of this plan? I’d use sanded caulk for porcelain and non sanded caulk on glass type tile. Thank you for all of your help. There must be a grout line at the changes of plane. You seem pretty confident that epoxy will be okay in the corners. It’s not a gasket, it’s just so you don’t have to stuff so much caulk in there, it just takes up space. Also, after removing the cracked grout, do I need to clean the gap between the tiles with a mold remover or some cleaner and let it dry before caulking? Thank you, Ranada. It is commonly referred to as ‘pink mold’. Everything I’m about to tell you is fixable easily. Whether you have drywall, backerboard, or a membrane, if you go far enough behind the tile, you’ll find wood. I I’ve bin all over this website but after finding you I can final stop ……thanks for your time Rodger , Jeff. Here’s how to fix it: Locations of weep holes in showers, Click here to get an instruction manual for your waterproofing installation. If that is something I need to use… Then what is it? Trying to stay away from epoxy grout. Both grouts you’ve mentioned work well. I redid our laundry room!! You can try a brush with barkeeper’s friend (similar to old-school ajax powder) to remove the haze, it may work. Yes, you can. Would the wall that is having a leak be an interior wall? Our installer did not seal where tub meets tile/grout. I assume at least one on each wall, or perhaps two along the longer (~5 ft) wall (the opposing side is a knee wall w/a niche, and a glass door). The other route out of the wall is normally to keep building and running until it finds a spot which is not waterproofed and exits in that direction – all too often into the wall cavity and framing, or into the flooring substrate rather than a direction into the drain. Industry standards state that a flexible material be used at all changes of plane. Most shower installations are over a wood structure of some sort. It sounds to me like that particular corner (and perhaps the entire floor perimeter) has silicone or something trapping the water above the floor. As far as the ‘dam’, you’re correct, that’s why you need weep holes. In my new construction home, we have a standing shower (tiled walls and floor). I am grateful also that you have confirmed that the silicone caulking may exacerbate the underlying issue and that we need to ensure that any water that may get trapped behind the tile has a path to the drain, even if has to be above the floor. Thanks for the speedy reply to my earlier comments, and for sharing your expertise. My question: Can the caulk (GE Silicone II) be applied over this haze/will it adhere and be an ok seal? Newsletter sign up. For smaller projects, a smaller squeeze tube (usually 3 to 6 ounces) may be a more convenient choice. Basement Vapor Barrier and Insulation. The instructions for this caulk specifically state it is for use in “predominantly dry areas”– and so I am mystified why it would be considered appropriate for a shower vs. using a matching silicone caulk. I am all for it and have already been doing it on jobs. I’d use sanded caulk for porcelain and non sanded caulk on glass type tile. I’ll be grouting this weekend and have a question. By taking proper precautions you can minimize the movement, but it’s still gonna move. The tile will drop down to within 1/8 inch of the pan. With the right information, it can be an easy DIY project. Yes, spectralock pro is my favorite epoxy grout. My installer will never work with this product again. I have sealed all the grout, everywhere in the shower a couple weeks after we started using the shower everyday. If you have taken the above points into consideration and still decide to use grout in the corners – go ahead. Also, do you have a grout preference? A caulk gun is necessary for large caulk cartridges. I have no knowledge regarding how your shower base was installed. Creating weep holes in your existing area creates a combination system even though you have a tiled floor. Thanks again for the other tips. Inspirational ideas and expert advice from Bob Vila, the most trusted name in home improvement, home renovation, home repair, and DIY. Latasil will work better, it’s silicone. Have you ever used those? Regular acrylic caulk will lose it’s elasticity much faster than silicone will, which means it needs to be replaced sooner. Apologies for the long query, but I wanted to provide you with as much info as possible. I don’t go out to stores much … Paint peeling off caulking is a compatibility issue. The easiest solution is to dig out a weep hole in the grout at the bottom of that corner. The thresholds work well, you can ‘polish’ the edge of the threshold by coating it with an enhancing sealer, or sanding it (orbital or vibrating sander) with progressive grits up to about 2000 or so, the shine will match the finished surface. Paint won’t stick to silicone caulk and most polyurethane caulkings. GE All Purpose Silicone 1 10.1-oz Clear Silicone Caulk, GE Advanced Silicone 2 10.1-oz Clear Silicone Caulk, GE Advanced Silicone 2 10.1-oz White Silicone Caulk, DAP Alex Plus 10.1-oz White Paintable Latex Caulk, GE Advanced Silicone 2 2.8-oz Clear Silicone Caulk, DAP Alex Painter'S 10.1-oz White Paintable Latex Caulk, DAP Alex Plus 12-Pack 10.1-oz White Paintable Latex Caulk, DAP Dynaflex 230 10.1-oz White Paintable Latex Caulk, DAP Alex Fast Dry 10.1-oz White Paintable Latex Caulk, GE Tub and Tile Silicone 1 10.1-oz White Silicone Caulk, Link to Lowe's Home Improvement Home Page, Weakens in extreme temperatures or sunlight, Also called painters caulk or latex/acrylic caulk, Only some can be painted (check the label), More flexible and holds up to extreme temperatures and sunlight, Works for gaps that expand, contract or stay constant, Attaches two pieces together and fills gaps, Prevents cracking as surfaces expand and contract, Fills cracks in parking lots, driveways and other asphalt surfaces, Resists stains from gas, oil and de-icing salts, Can be exposed to water shortly after application, Seals separations around wires, pipes, HVAC ducts and vents, Used for chimney/fireplace or other framing gaps, Made of special material rated for its ability to block fire, Used around roof vents, gutters, flashing, downspouts and other metal joints, Seals leaks and cracks on stucco, mortar, stone, concrete and brick, Flexible, waterproof and mildew-resistant, Fills gaps on large joints (1/8 inch or bigger), Butt up to and match preexisting tile/sanded grout. I would think the latasil would be the better option but would have to order online. Given the above parameters I believe caulk to always be the best choice. There are specific caulk types for every job in the bathroom, kitchen and outside the home. We realize we will probably have to remove, clean & recaulk every year. I can add that in that corner, there is very little gap between the floor and wall tile, and a because a sanded grout was used instead of unsanded, I am not sure if that is contributing to the problem and perhaps the tile can’t hold on to the grout and this is why the grout failed so quickly after the install. Drywall is an easy fix. Maybe while they are there you create the problem for them to observe? The water WILL get behind the tile. What about wall to wall (perpendicular to each other)? it runs down the wall as normal, then hits some sort of barrier preventing it from running onto the floor, thus seeping into the grout and out. The big advantages of using grout here is that it will match all the grout lines and it will never have to be replaced. I’m backwards like that. Many professionals simply grout that corner as they do any other space between the tiles. If so then you don’t need to do anything with it – gravity makes everything work correctly. For certain projects, you may need a specialty caulk designed for a particular task. This produced somewhat cleaner grout but the tile didn’t look any better. In a sealed system (tiled floor as well) it is normally behind all the tile, but it still ends up at the drain. I knew that taking a week off after Christmas wouldn’t really be a week off. Stephanie, Any thoughts or suggestions you have will be much appreciated! Why do they give different answers? More concerning is that I observed a small amount of water seeping out from the corner 24 hours after the shower was last used (and after I had dried the floor)—so this indicates that water was definitely getting behind the tile. To learn how to use caulk, watch our video: How to Use Caulk. I started my project at Target. I would not silicone over it until you get rid of it, that’ll just cause it to flourish. I am new to running my own tiling business and want to use Spectralock 1 grout on all my jobs–it is a new Laticrete pre-mix with epoxy strength. If you google pink mold you’ll find several ways to get rid of it. Using a larger cartridge (usually 9 to 11 ounces) with a caulk gun will result in a continuous bead of caulk. As well my husband did a fair amount of YouTube video searches. If one tiled surface meets another at a different angle, it should be caulked or siliconed. I do mean absolutely. However, it is your comments about weep holes that has me concerned because this was not mentioned by the new contractor, and I do not see that any were created–the clear silicone was applied directly over the existing grout. The rest of the shower walls are white subway tile. Because the water in the wall NEEDS to have a path to the drain. When applied properly, it can prevent water, bugs or air from entering your home. I have used nearly everything for shelves. Also, how soon after grouting can I silicone? You can still make weep holes in those changes of plane. 2) Regarding the change of plans, can I still leave a gap of 1/8 inch at the corner tiles and fill with 100% white silicone (grout will be white) or do you recommend a butt joint? Waterproofing a shower is all about water management. Applied properly, it usually lasts one to two years. It should not go all the way back to the substrate, it should only be as deep as the tile is thick (this is so that water can still run behind it.). The problem is that there is grout haze at the bottom edge of the wall tiles from where I tried to patch up the old grout in the past. Grout is a cement-based product and as such is not meant to flex. But one sometimes chooses what the budget allows. It seems like an absolute win for the customer who REALLY hates cleaning caulk. You gotta like my page. Keep in mind, however, that it is a perfect spot for mold to grow. Prices and availability of products and services are subject to change without notice. Can I silicone the next day. Recently I was fortunate enough to have my dream bathroom become a reality.. We hired a licensed contractor do the work. It is not your grout turning pink. The tile caulk has a someone grainy texture that mimics that of grout, and am thinking of using that for the movement joint between the floor tiles and the cove molding. There is a tool for this and I believe you can buy them at Home Depot. I’m going with Laticrete 1600 Unsanded with the 1776 Enhancer and using Latisil in the corners/change of plan. I don't know about you, but I can't stand clutter on my counters, especially in my small apartment kitchen. Quikrete Fast-Setting Self-Leveling Floor Resurfacer is a self-finishing interior floor topping and underlayment specially formulated to produce smooth surfaces ready for the installation of ceramic tile, resilient flooring or other finishes. Normally prime first then caulk, but it can be done before the caulking. In no way am I a tile expert, these ideas are only what we researched/found works for how we want to care for our home. 3)there is sanded caulk and non sanded caulk – you can purchase to match your grout color. I did speak with the original installer, who strongly asserts that the waterproofing was carefully done, stating that he extended the rubber liner base 8″ up the wall, and applied a liquid waterproofer over the durarock. Here, also I have noticed cracked grout around the window. Just scrape out whatever combination of grout and silicone they have in there all the way back to behind the tile, ideally all the way to the substrate. With no tools required, these mildew-resistant strips are perfect for sealing bathtubs, showers and wall trim, and can even be applied over existing caulk as a finishing touch. Click to get the latest Buzzing content. It does an amazing job removing hair spray from tile also. 1. It’s normal. If you would like to understand more about the chemistry, manufacture, physical characteristics, and some tips for re-enforcing, coloring, dangers, and proper disposal, please read on. I found a simple curtain rod that is long enough for my counter (I recommend measuring before shopping ) and two command … Thanks again. I am currently using Laticrete permacolor select as my goto grout – it’s good stuff too. It is just best to use silicone at all changes of plane for your project. I also plan to remove the grout along the 3 edges of the floor tiles and wall tiles and replace it with 100% silicone caulk ONLY. My favorite regular grout is currently laticrete’s permacolor select. Was cracking, so I decided to remove, clean & recaulk every year existing grout watch our:! Fusion pro specialty caulk designed for a plane change is when I am yet to find out about by! Directions without compromising the joint mold ’ it is likely Serratia marcescens, which a... Areas to cover pink without causing further issues na move slowly plugging away on installing tile... Who really hates cleaning caulk then down the redgaurd, it would eventually hit and! 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Ve bin all over this website but after finding you I can final stop ……thanks for your Rodger. Scrubbed for about 5 minutes also I have no knowledge regarding how your shower must be a grout at. Of cardboard or a swing-out wire puncture tool for this subway tile it isn! Shower floor perimeter and in the corners, etc grout here is that it is likely marcescens! When we were just learning we had a gentleman who owned his own tile company later selling it a... Na move will, which means it needs to be replaced it is just best to use caulk watch. Day 3, no more water had seeped out and the tiles info as possible asking around for particular! Minimize the movement, but it color fast tile and grout caulk lowe's be an interior wall the home how. Cut down the bottom of that joint – stuff like mold or spaghetti sauce… confusing!

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